I really enjoy playing as the hunter, it's my most favorite part of this game. A few times since I got L4D2 I've had a few people (more than likely new to the game) try and call me a cheater or exploiter or whatever because they saw me pouncing off invisible walls repeatedly. I thought nothing of it since I've been doing it since L4D 1 and it just feels like part of the game to me but then I tried to see it through their eyes and now I'm doubting it. Is it an exploit? I don't think Valve intended hunters to be pouncing off of invisible walls. It's totally not our fault that their shitty level designs have forced us to, what with the lack of tall buildings and stuff. What do you guys think?

This was my arguement for calling the charger claw glitch an exploit. I don't have any problem with it.

If they did not want you to do it, then you would not be able to do it. Although, silent hunter still exists...

[opinion]It's quite simple really. One of the main uses of the hunter is quick and easy damage, a high risk [getting skeeted/deadstopped/missing] for a high reward [up to 25 damage instantly, with about 5 to 10 damage per second afterwards]. The L4D2 maps do not feature enough points in which to take adequate advantage of this risk/reward concept, and so without the invisible walls, no one would want to play as Hunter anymore because he is obsolete. A Smoker/Jockey not only does constant damage, but can also separate, the Charger can do up to 600 damage instantly, at the expense of the Charger. The Hunter used to also be good for scratches, but now the Charger does more damage per swipe and the Spitter drops a pool of acid when it dies.

IMO, Invisible Walls are not an exploit, I've been picked and skeeted just as many times if not more times, and those who bitch about it are probably just mad they can't do it themselves.[/opinion]

stopped reading right there

missed out on a decent opinion. Cheers Sarah

Except its an exploit because you're not supposed to be able to get up there. Exploiting is just that - exploiting a flaw in the game to gain some sort of advantage.

The hunter might not seem so glorious at first glance, but it is the ultimate team oriented SI due to his extreme mobility as well as his ability to remain silent when spawned in when not crouched. Good teams will rarely waste the hunter by going for high damage, they'll use him to go after a straggler or pin a player the other pinning class SI cannot easily reach without getting picked off, or get an intercept on a survivor trying to rescue another pinned survivor. The hunter is also the perfect distracting class, with his ability to rebound and relative extreme speed, the hunter can easily pounce in and around and amongst the survivors to cause a distraction to allow the other SI a greater chance at pulling off their respective attacks.

Granted, its not that terrible of an exploit, because its usually just mediocre players or teams trying to bother with it as its far more likely you'll miss and/or get killed and thus hurt your teams' chance at a more coordinated attack.

So, it is an exploit but one that any good player who's got his eye on the prize wouldn't use anyways, yes?

How about other glitches such as meleeing a witch who has stumbled to make her continue to stumble.
(my opinion) Meleeing an already stumbling witch is not so bad and I don't even know if it was intended. But if you were up against a good team, they'd stop you somehow. It's their own fault if the witch dies, I guess?

Or the grenade launcher on the DC Finale.
(again, my opinion) For people who don't know, the grenade launcher on one of the towers does not disappear when someone picks it up. So, you can shoot and pick up a new one instead of reloading which takes way longer. This is an exploit but again, one that is easily countered by a good team. You are mega vulnerable at the top of that tower. All the "pro" players hang out in the Stage right bleachers. Up on the tower you'd in for a world of hurt if a smoker or jockey grabs hold of you.

I lied, i read it . l4d2 sux tho /thread

'good teams' don't play in games that don't have grenade launchers and shit modded out + that shit lags the server having 500 guns in a pile.

Re:Bojangles, and other intent arguers

When it comes to classifying stuff as exploits, we often turn to the "Intent" argument. If the developers did not intend it, it is an exploit. This has two issues: One, we do not know the developers' intent. And two, why do we care what the developers intended?

When talking about scavenge canbombing, people said that the developers did not intend to have the cans be movable to the generator using pipebombs. Yet, the functionality of cans moving when hit by pipes was built-in. "Shortcuts" people say are unintended. Yet, we're talking about valve--they have always built their games with flexibility in them. We're supposed to be able to fuck around and find new solutions to problems (See Portal). Although some solutions to problems may be considered "cheap," I don't think we can go so far as to say that any of them would be frowned upon by the developers.

Two, the developers' intent may not really matter for us. They produced the game for a broad audience and probably didn't consider the competitive players as much as they did their wider audience. More people have played campaign than versus, and more people play pub games badly than play the game well. This probably led to a number of Anti-Infected Pro-Survivor decisions that are great for keeping casual players alive in versus, but ridiculous for competitive play. Again, the developers' intent has little to do with us.

tl;dr We don't know what the developers intended and it doesn't matter.

On Topic: There are invisible walls you can't pounce off of. There are some you can. There are non-textured areas you can get on top of to pounce from (HR skyboxes, DeC2 buildings). However, none of this is any different from L4D1. No mercy 4 had nontextured areas to pounce from, and nomercy 5 had invisible skybox walls to pounce from. I wasn't around for L4D1 compo play, but I'd say the same rulings should apply.

Main Entry: 1ex·ploit
Pronunciation: \?ek-?splo?it, ik-?\
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English espleit, expleit, exploit furtherance, outcome, from Anglo-French, from Latin explicitum, neuter of explicitus, past participle
Date: circa 1538

: deed, act

this clearly is a deed AND in fact an act, so, ladies and gentleman, this is indeed a double exploit

SITATION NEEDED


http://www.l4d.com/blog/post.php?id=3362


IIRC the rules were that it was illegal to pounce off any invisible walls.

Why are you here then? Oh wait, you're not. , not for a couple days at least.

in my book, grenade launcher pickup spam? ok. witch melee? ok. (lolz I have no sympathy for anyone who is too pants-on-head to not act on someone meleeing a staggered witch) Skipping part of the map? not ok.

I think you mean citation.
Your link/quote has little to do with my statement. I said more players have played campaign than versus. It is just an assumption, but I would say that most (if not all) versus players have also played campaign. I'm just saying that there are likely more players who have played campaign and not versus than versus and not campaign. I'm pretty sure the whole "teamwork + killing zombies" has more widespread/casual appeal than "teamwork + killing zombies + dealing with ragequits, griefers, and assholes + getting fucked really hard."

Good to know about the L4D1 ruling though.

I know a bunch of people IRL that say they "Play l4d2." and when i say that i play versus they are like--"ZOMG! What is this VERSUS?". And i have to explain the whole 4v4, you get to play as the SI. its stupid, Versus should be the main online gamemode. not campaign. people only learn that COMPUTER zombies have no brains-therefore they eat yours, but end up failing.

It sucks having real friends that totally blow at videogames...there is no challenge when I play with my friends... (and when i try to help them play campaign it is usually a miserable failure.)

They just should be shown a video of visceral, then they'd be inspired to use the invis walls to their advantage. always lookin for a new wall to pounce off of.

It's probably an exploit because Valve didn't intend for hunters to pounce off of nothing, therefore it is abusing a flaw in game mechanics. But people call bunnyhopping an exploit, too, and that's been around (and built into some games on purpose) ever since Quake.

It doesn't matter if it's an exploit or not, what matters is what the tournament rules say about it.

And Bojangles is right, it doesn't even matter in the end because sky boxing isn't even used in comp play.